Comments on: Madness personified

By: Dennis Howlett

Dennis Howlett — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 17:35:46 +0000

Cultural mores are very difficult to understand until you live with them. I could write reams on Muslim culture you never hear. When folk swing the Islamist card at me I always ask the same questions – Ever read the Koran? Ever talked to Muslims about what it means? I have no specific religious soap box but I do believe in making some attempt to understand. In the UK, the vast majority of the Muslim community are peaceful folk who want to be part of the fabric of British life. Heck – they gave us curry!

BTW – Vinnie has written a very thoughtful piece on the Mumbai bombings. http://dealarchitect.typepad.com/deal_architect/2006/07/india_blasts.html

You’re right Curt. I was surprised at the lack of ‘gamesmanship’ during the whole of the games. Spanish and Italian soccer is rife with that sort of thing. I joke that Spanish players have 2 days playing, 2 days training, 1 day nursing their endorsemenrt sponsors, 1 day off and 1 day at acting classes.

IMO – the referees should have stamped on this from the get go, making it clear you get one chance and you’re off. That would have done a lot to curtail the practice but then there’s millions of others out there with other passionate opinions.

By: Curt Wehrley

Curt Wehrley — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 17:19:38 +0000

Andrew Sullivan just used the word I was looking for earlier: stoicism. Check out his latest post at
http://time.blogs.com/daily_dish/2006/07/bombay_and_stoi.html

By: Curt Wehrley

Curt Wehrley — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 14:42:08 +0000

Good points, Dennis. My perspective derives from American culture. Muslim culture might prompt one to throw my advice out the window in certain situations.

Come to think of it, the real issue here should probably be the number of red cards issued during the Cup — in other words, the behavior of athletes during competition. I’m not just picking on the Europeans here — we Americans have demonstrated our share of poor on-field behavior in various sports as of late.

By: Dennis Howlett

Dennis Howlett — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 14:26:12 +0000

I don’t trust Wikipedia – I know a fair bit about Muslim culture, over half our family are practicing Sunnis at 3 different mosques. (Which makes going to the pub interesting.)

All press reports I’ve seen going back many years affirm his beliefs and practices. Which raises the question – do you believe the press as purveyors of fact?

Doesn’t excuse and as they say – there are always 3 sides to a story: yours, mine and something approximating the truth. Now we have 4 – Wikipedia.

By: Gary Turner

Gary Turner — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 14:21:15 +0000

According to his Wikipedia page, he’s not a practicing Musilm. Not that this makes much diff.

By: Tom Raftery

Tom Raftery — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 14:16:57 +0000

Zidane is due to speak at a press conference this evening about the incident so we’ll know more than however, I have to agree with Curt – Zidane let himself down badly by falling for this troll. It played right into Italy’s hands. I wouldn’t be surprised if it was even planned. Zidane should have known better. He probably let fatigue cloud his judgement.

By: Dennis Howlett

Dennis Howlett — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 13:59:57 +0000

I’ve since read in both the French and Spanish news papers that a lip reader believes Matterazzi insulted his mother and called him a ‘terrorist.’ Zidane has been quiet about it. If true then these are dreadful things to say to a devout Muslim like Zidane. It’s hard to understand this from a cultural perspective. It still doesn’t excuse but where do you draw the line?

By: Curt Wehrley

Curt Wehrley — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 13:53:19 +0000

The provocation does not justify the response.

I played college basketball in the U.S. back in the 1980s. I was not a great athlete, but I know what it feels like to get spitting mad at a competitor who dishes out verbal and/or physical abuse. I was punched in the gut during a game on numerous occasions, and heard plenty of trash talk.

Most of the legends in sport will tell you that they’ve endured the kind of provocation Zidane probably experienced — when you’re that good, you’ll hear plenty of it. Some simply ignored it. Others channel the anger from it into their performance. They knew that responding to it would distract them from delivering their best performance.

I would have thought that a player of Zidane’s caliber and level of experience would simply ignore that stuff. In fact, you expect a leader like him to be the one mentoring younger players on how to handle it.

Even though I’m not a big fan of football, I had the same feeling when I saw the headbutt: sadness at witnessing the implosion of a legendary athlete.

By: Gary Turner

Gary Turner — Mon, 10 Jul 2006 22:16:47 +0000

Dennis,

My thoughts and feeling exactly. I envisaged him picking up the trophy and then talking off his boots for the last time in a Hollywood/Roy Of The Rovers moment of brilliance we rarely get to see these days. I was gutted when the alternate universe showed up.

But from reading the press today and seeing him being warmly greeting in Paris I’ve changed my mind and now believe that standing up for your dignity is a price worth paying, and he paid a big price.

So, he was the best player of his generation and ultimately had his instinctive priorities right too.

Not a bad rap in the end.

By: Emily Coltman

Emily Coltman — Mon, 10 Jul 2006 14:57:21 +0000

Tom’s right – the commentators said during the presentation that Zidane “wasn’t allowed” to lead his team up and collect his medal.

I can’t help feeling sorry for Zidane as I’m sure he must have had provocation.

If the Italian player (and unfortunately I can’t spell his name) provoked him with racist / insulting remarks then I think he should get the same post match ban / fine as Zidane.

That’s if Zidane can be given a post match punishment now he’s resigned.