Comments on: Defining saas: the faulty Touring Test http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/ Thu, 09 Feb 2012 10:01:51 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Instant 3D gratification – for free | 3D Gaming http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6330 Instant 3D gratification – for free | 3D Gaming Wed, 13 May 2009 16:57:30 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6330 [...] Defining saas: the faulty Touring Test (accmanpro.com) Permalink Comments [View commentsComments] blog comments powered by Disqus var disqus_url = 'http://www.3dactiongame.com/?p=318 '; var disqus_container_id = 'disqus_thread'; var facebookXdReceiverPath = 'http://www.3dactiongame.com/wp-content/plugins/disqus-comment-system/xd_receiver.htm'; var DsqLocal = { 'trackbacks': [ ], 'trackback_url': 'http://www.3dactiongame.com/wp-trackback.php?p=318' }; [...] [...] Defining saas: the faulty Touring Test (accmanpro.com) Permalink Comments [View commentsComments] blog comments powered by Disqus var disqus_url = ‘http://www.3dactiongame.com/?p=318 ‘; var disqus_container_id = ‘disqus_thread’; var facebookXdReceiverPath = ‘http://www.3dactiongame.com/wp-content/plugins/disqus-comment-system/xd_receiver.htm'; var DsqLocal = { ‘trackbacks’: [ ], ‘trackback_url’: ‘http://www.3dactiongame.com/wp-trackback.php?p=318‘ }; [...]

]]> By: Mike McDerment http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6329 Mike McDerment Wed, 13 May 2009 14:21:14 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6329 Hey Dennis...not going to wade to far into this, but did want to show my face. All I can say about SaaN is it was mainly intended for the tech audience, not customers. It's a new way to approach software design and we wanted to make that point. Said another way, it is tech babble for techies...the flip side of this coin is, a significant portion of our customers are techies...and they get the benefit of this piece of tech babble...which kind of brings things full circle. Hey Dennis…not going to wade to far into this, but did want to show my face.

All I can say about SaaN is it was mainly intended for the tech audience, not customers. It's a new way to approach software design and we wanted to make that point. Said another way, it is tech babble for techies…the flip side of this coin is, a significant portion of our customers are techies…and they get the benefit of this piece of tech babble…which kind of brings things full circle.

]]> By: Gerry Allan http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6328 Gerry Allan Wed, 13 May 2009 14:17:09 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6328 Runs in a web-browser with no additional software required: Is this really a requirement for something to be Saas. Any Windows application could be delivered in a remotely hosted fashion via Terminal Services or Citrix. The Terminal Services (RDP) client is preinstalled on all Windows PCs since XP Pro, so there is no requirement for any additional client installation. I do not understand the preoccupation with the web browser as the only delivery mechanism. Runs in a web-browser with no additional software required:

Is this really a requirement for something to be Saas. Any Windows application could be delivered in a remotely hosted fashion via Terminal Services or Citrix. The Terminal Services (RDP) client is preinstalled on all Windows PCs since XP Pro, so there is no requirement for any additional client installation. I do not understand the preoccupation with the web browser as the only delivery mechanism.

]]> By: Emily Coltman http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6327 Emily Coltman Mon, 11 May 2009 20:15:27 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6327 Re your video - take your fair point :-) M Re your video – take your fair point :-)

M

]]> By: Jeremy Roche http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6326 Jeremy Roche Mon, 11 May 2009 14:34:59 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6326 Against the definition from John Paterson that Dennis quotes above, I don't think the 'Touring' test works. How does the test John defines actually prove that the application meets his SaaS definition? We have been delivering on-premises/hosted applications since 2000 that meet the test of use in a hotel browser with no plug-ins. In fact in the early years we occasionally used a hotel browser as the proof that it really was a 100% browser app (that's when browser apps were cool advanced technology, probably not something to boast about since about 2002!). I wouldn't define these apps as SaaS though and they don't meet the other parts of the definition. Just using an app in a browser is hardly a test of anything these days. I can use exchange via webmail on the hotel receptionists PC, but it is something hosted by us and behind our firewall, not really anyone's definition of SaaS. I guess you could modify the Touring test to say you should demonstrate that you can sign up for a trial and then pay a subscription immediately and have the app provisioned before your eyes and then use it in a real environment. That would then show that the app was more SaaS. If John wants to define a test, then he should define one that meets all the aspects of his SaaS definition and not one small part of it, that it runs without plug-ins in a browser. We should all remember though that prospective customers are typically more interested in what an application can do for their business than the delivery model. Customers buy apps primarily because they are compelling and you are compelling as a company, not because of the way they happen to be delivered. Part of the reason a SaaS app can be compelling is because of the value propositions such as Opex vs Capex, reduction in operating costs, less headaches with managing servers etc, but at the end of the day, it still needs to be a good app. Against the definition from John Paterson that Dennis quotes above, I don't think the 'Touring' test works. How does the test John defines actually prove that the application meets his SaaS definition?

We have been delivering on-premises/hosted applications since 2000 that meet the test of use in a hotel browser with no plug-ins. In fact in the early years we occasionally used a hotel browser as the proof that it really was a 100% browser app (that's when browser apps were cool advanced technology, probably not something to boast about since about 2002!). I wouldn't define these apps as SaaS though and they don't meet the other parts of the definition.

Just using an app in a browser is hardly a test of anything these days. I can use exchange via webmail on the hotel receptionists PC, but it is something hosted by us and behind our firewall, not really anyone's definition of SaaS.

I guess you could modify the Touring test to say you should demonstrate that you can sign up for a trial and then pay a subscription immediately and have the app provisioned before your eyes and then use it in a real environment. That would then show that the app was more SaaS.

If John wants to define a test, then he should define one that meets all the aspects of his SaaS definition and not one small part of it, that it runs without plug-ins in a browser.

We should all remember though that prospective customers are typically more interested in what an application can do for their business than the delivery model. Customers buy apps primarily because they are compelling and you are compelling as a company, not because of the way they happen to be delivered. Part of the reason a SaaS app can be compelling is because of the value propositions such as Opex vs Capex, reduction in operating costs, less headaches with managing servers etc, but at the end of the day, it still needs to be a good app.

]]> By: Dennis Howlett http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6325 Dennis Howlett Mon, 11 May 2009 13:16:06 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6325 [kaltura-widget wid="kcaz8n9wbw" size="comments" /] [kaltura-widget wid="kcaz8n9wbw" size="comments" /]

]]> By: Emily Coltman http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6324 Emily Coltman Mon, 11 May 2009 13:04:41 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6324 I grant you that. But Duane's post doesn't read like it was meant as a sales post to me, but as a techie discussion. So it reads to me like you're giving him 0 out of 10 for failing in Geography, when he was actually doing a French test :-) M I grant you that. But Duane's post doesn't read like it was meant as a sales post to me, but as a techie discussion.

So it reads to me like you're giving him 0 out of 10 for failing in Geography, when he was actually doing a French test :-)

M

]]> By: Dennis Howlett http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6323 Dennis Howlett Mon, 11 May 2009 12:41:59 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6323 @jim: I have no doubt but as I tried to convey in the piece, I'm not convinced that a tech led intro matters. It's got to be about the benefits for the simple reason that switching is so hard for people who have a 600 year old history they can look back on and say: 'What's wrong with that?' @jim: I have no doubt but as I tried to convey in the piece, I'm not convinced that a tech led intro matters. It's got to be about the benefits for the simple reason that switching is so hard for people who have a 600 year old history they can look back on and say: 'What's wrong with that?'

]]> By: Jim Bennett http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6322 Jim Bennett Mon, 11 May 2009 12:05:36 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6322 Have to say I think you've missed a trick here Dennis, as any salesperson who tried to use multi-tenanted or remote hosted in their opening gambit wouldn't be putting bread on their table. In contrast, a salesperson who used the actual touring test would probably be off to a good start, before hitting the actual discussion of benefits and value. As a metaphor for the benefits of SaaS, it's actually fairly elegant. It isn't the whole conversation, but it is memorable, concise, and helps get the message across to techie and non-techie listeners alike. In that context, it adds value to have such a definition. Have to say I think you've missed a trick here Dennis, as any salesperson who tried to use multi-tenanted or remote hosted in their opening gambit wouldn't be putting bread on their table. In contrast, a salesperson who used the actual touring test would probably be off to a good start, before hitting the actual discussion of benefits and value. As a metaphor for the benefits of SaaS, it's actually fairly elegant. It isn't the whole conversation, but it is memorable, concise, and helps get the message across to techie and non-techie listeners alike. In that context, it adds value to have such a definition.

]]> By: Dennis Howlett http://www.accmanpro.com/2009/05/09/defining-saas-the-faulty-touring-test/comment-page-1/#comment-6321 Dennis Howlett Mon, 11 May 2009 11:42:37 +0000 http://www.accmanpro.com/?p=4735#comment-6321 ...and while we're at, let's not forget my history of critiquing SAP, Oracle, Microsoft, Sage and others...but if you look closely you'll see the title referred to the Touring Test which parsed something written elsewhere. …and while we're at, let's not forget my history of critiquing SAP, Oracle, Microsoft, Sage and others…but if you look closely you'll see the title referred to the Touring Test which parsed something written elsewhere.

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